Post by Taylorholic78 on Feb 10, 2006 23:11:49 GMT -5
For over 20 years, Nick Rhodes has been messing with synths as part of Duran Duran. He's become quite an opinionated tech-head, as John McIver discovers.
Cast your mind back a couple of decades, and if you can bear it, you just may be able to recall a couple of images from the music scene of the time. Firstly, a bunch of five blokes in make-up and shiny suits sitting on the prow of a yacht in an impossibly exotic lagoon singing about someone called Rio. Secondly, the deeply snooty cheek-boned pout of their keyboard player, a bloke from Birmingham called Nicholas Bates who changed his name to something cooler to suit the band, the leaders of the so-called new Romantic Movement - Duran Duran.
Wait! Come back! They've grown up, settled down and are far less snobbish these nowadays. And Nick earns a place in our Pioneers series for three reasons: his constant search for technical innovation, his production instincts, and the way in which he laced some of the finest pop songs in history with the coolest synth sounds available. Behind the make-up, here is a man with dedication and talent.
After a decade in the commercial doldrums, the original Duran line-up (our man on keyboards, singer Simon Le Bon, and the three Taylors, bassist John, guitarist Andy and drummer Roger) are back with a vengeance.
With a gazillion-grossing stadium tour out of the way, and a new album Astronaut riding high in the album charts, it's little wonder that Nick is in a good mood when Future Music meets him...
FM: So let's go back in time to when you started out. This was an early time in music technology history when the gear wouldn't even sync. Surely awful compared to what you can do today?
NR: Well it was! On the first tour we did, sometimes I had 18 manual changes between songs. You had to change every knob on the synths! And my fear was that the bell sound on the song Nightboat would go out of tune. It was really extraordinary. Sometimes it was disastrously out of tune, and I'd be trying to tune it in between hitting it again.
FM: What gear were you using back then?
NR: At the very beginning, in 1978, the first thing that I bought was a Wasp (yellow and black plastic synthesizer that I only ever managed to get fart sounds out of - Ed). I also had a giant Stylophone, which I still have that features on the song Nice on the new album.
FM: What did you actually do with the Wasp?
NR: Well, you couldn't save anything on it, obviously, so you had to turn the knobs all the time to change things. So I had patch sheets that showed me where all the knobs had to be for various sounds, which I copied between the songs. But when I took the Roland System 100 out, that didn't last long - I couldn't deal with replugging all the wires and everything.
But I can't say often enough that each one of these things was so different, and that there was so much that I can do with them which I can't do elsewhere. This is the great pleasure of them. I've just bought a synth called a Crumar Spirit, which was developed by Bob Moog after he left Moog. It's an extraordinarily rare instrument these nowadays, and it isn't like anything else. The way the tones come out of it, the way the oscillators work, the LFO... it's just completely different.
FM: What's your current keyboard setup?
NR: On tour I used an Andromeda, a Roland V-Synth, a Jupiter 8, an Apple Mac G4 Powerbook and a K2000. I also use a little Microport for a couple of things like vocoding and bending the notes down. I don't really endorse any of those manufacturers at the moment, although Alesis have been really great to me. I am particularly fond of the Andromeda, because I'm a real purist when it comes to sound.
On the records, I really use almost entirely analogue gear: almost everything on the new album is analogue. There are samples, but I usually just go straight into Pro Tools. My trusty programmer is Mr. Digital and he loves samplers. He plays with all the software, but I'm always saying to him 'that's horrible - let's make it right.'
FM: So you're Mr. Analogue?
NR: I really am, even though I've got a lot of digital equipment. I really love the Korg Kaoss pad, for example.
FM: What programs are you running on the G4?
NR: I haven't got the faintest idea. There's a sequencer program, and I have Pro Tools on there. I don't use it live, but I use it if we're feeling creative in the few minutes we have between interviews and shows!
FM: Have you still got all your old gear?
NR: Yes, because I've re-bought that I've had nicked or lost along the way.
FM: Why don't you just emulate all the old sounds with a modern synth?
NR: (Horrified) Oh, God, no! That is horrible... just horrible! And it's not really possible. If you listen to the Virtual Prophet 5 and then listen to my Prophet 5, there is no comparison.
FM: Or you could just sample the old gear?
NR: Well, a lot of people love doing that because it makes life a lot easier. But I find that the records I really like are based on trying to see what sounds you can get out of something, and seeing what vibe you can create.
You can tell when a record's been mixed in Pro Tools. They sound a bit weedier and a bit thinner. The compression's not right and the separation's not right ... you know. I'm not saying that people haven't made great records by doing them digitally, but for my tastes, I like big, warm, edgy, cool sounds and digital isn't that.
If I use a digital set-up, which I do occasionally, I'll aim for a very digital sound because that's what I want to achieve. I don't ever use digital synths to replicate analogue synths, apart from in a live show.
FM: So do you literally plug your keyboard into an amplifier, then mic it up and record it like that?
NR: Of course. I'm the king of that process! We've used just about everything. I use tiny little cheap speakers and mic them up sometimes, or effects-pedal boards like the guitarists do. That's the fun of it. Even when I want a little reverb on something I tend to shy away from the digital reverb.
FM: You use a lot of samples live. Doesn't that conflict with what you said a minute ago about being a purist?
NR: Um ... no, not at all. Not in the live show. I think people now expect a much more accurate sound, and I wouldn't give them too much cheap, nasty digital stuff. I don't think it's fair to give them an assault to the ears. I've got several Jupiter 8's and we take them out - they're limping along, but they're now getting pretty old. The oscillators go out sometimes. I tried sampling the sounds a hundred times at really high rates, and it just doesn't behave the same. Synthesizers are so organic. The kids come along with their computers and digital things, but once they realise what a synth is and how it reacts... every single one is so different.
FM: Do you really think that the average person at a Duran Duran show is likely to perceive the difference between the original sound and a sample of it?
NR: In the live show, if it's just a regular sound and you're playing, absolutely not. But with a sound that is distinctive, they'd probably know it doesn't sound the same, although they probably wouldn't know why. I think the sound differences are enormous, I really do.
FM: What's the worst thing about today's keyboard technology?
NR: My absolute nightmare is multi-function buttons. I cannot understand why anyone ever wanted to do that. You find your number, and you click it round, and you hit it again ... I loathe that. Not only does it slow down the process, but you really do have to read the manual - and I've never been good at that.
I've always preferred the excitement of the exploration and finding out where things are. Clearly the advent of MIDI made live performance much easier, although some of my early synths did not enjoy being updated, particularly the Jupiter 8. I couldn't believe my luck when I could just hit one button.
FM: Did you study piano before you got into playing keyboards?
NR: No, not at all. I started on guitar when I was about 13 and managed to figure out the chords to Anarchy in the UK. But I was a huge Kraftwerk and Gary Numan fan, as well as John Foxx and Ultravox - an extraordinarily under-rated musician. So I saved up enough money to buy the Wasp, which was really the first affordable synthesizer. It cost about £200, which was a lot of money back then, but nothing compared to thousands you had to pay for big Moog systems. I just loved the idea of manipulating sound - at that time I hadn't perceived that in years to come I'd have a whole orchestra of tones at such easy access.
FM: Have you always kept up with new developments in keyboard technology over the years?
NR: Oh, yes, always. I always know what gear has come out. I've had different relationships with Roland and Moog, and they've always been good at keeping me updated. Part of what I do is find out what's going on and use the newest sounds that are out there.
At the end of the ’80s, I bought a whole bunch of digital things and used them on the albums. I've regretted jumping on the bandwagon with some of those things, so now I just stick to the things that sound best.
The Andromeda is really great: extensively analogue, but digitally controlled, and has a character - which is what it's all about, really. I don't use preset sounds, I always make sounds.
FM: How did the dance music explosion of the late ’80s and early ’90s affect you as a keyboard player and as a producer?
NR: It was particularly good for drum machines that you could sequence although I never got into them heavily because at that time - I suppose 1987 to 1990 - we'd just made the Notorious album and we were on tour. I wanted to make a very clean, precise album, and there were fewer keyboards on there than any of our other ones. We wanted a funk sound, with Chic and Sly & The Family Stone influences - so that didn't really lend itself to using drum machines. I got into them a little more on the Big Thing album, though. But at the time you had the whole Synclavier thing going on.
FM: Did you ever take the classic sampling Fairlight route?
NR: Oh yeah! At one time Peter Gabriel, Kate Bush, Trevor Horn and myself all had one. It was new territory and it was so exciting. It had a character that was undeniable and identifiable, and I had a lot of fun with it.
FM: What did you specifically use it for?
NR: I used it a lot on the third album, Seven and the Ragged Tiger. It's all over songs like Union of the Snake - that sequence at the start is all Fairlight - and New Moon on Monday. I used samples for those bits live. I don't have the Fairlight anymore.
FM: Sampling back then must have been a slow process?
NR: Yeah, absolutely. If we wanted to use those sounds live I was either running them from the Fairlight, which got quite complicated, or - in later years - on a tape! I had to actually hit the button and it would go.
FM: As the Duran line-up changed over the years, was it easy to take on extra roles like percussion?
NR: Yes, I've always thought in those terms anyway. It's much easier having a drummer - Roger's great with drum machines and programming - but I'm quite good at working out where the beats need to go.
FM: How did you get into producing Kajagoogoo?
NR: The singer, Limahl, gave me a demo of their songs and I thought Too Shy was really good. Apart from our first album, I'd never really been involved in production and thought it would be interesting to work with other people. I had no fear of it, because I knew what everything did by then, so I just helped them along with the songs and it was done.
FM: You've also produced bands like the Dandy Warhols.
NR: Yeah, I approach them the same way that I would approach Duran's music, in that you've got to have a song first that is worth spending time on. Then all the melodies and lyrics have got to be right, and the arrangement has to be in place. But the fortunate thing about coming from a keyboard background is that now you literally can bring up a drum set, set up a rhythm, play a synth bass-line and start building it up and see where you can go. Cut it up in Pro Tools and move it around. I always start from the bottom up. But for me, production is all about vibe. It's all about getting the performances out of people and going the opposite direction to the horrible, homogenous junk music that is out there right now.
FM: How are your programming skills?
NR: On Pro Tools, hopeless, because I like to sit back and view from the point of the whole thing. If I started getting into programming, I'd be a nightmare, because the detail would kill me. My tech is invaluable. I'm perfectly capable of plugging things in and making them work myself, but it's just always great to have someone to help out.
I actually work incredibly quickly in the studio, despite the fact that the new Duran Duran album has taken such a long time. We've got almost enough material for three albums. But during that process I tend to build things, layer after layer, and then strip it down from there. I follow my natural instincts.
FM: Is there a viable alternative to Pro Tools, in your opinion?
NR: Well, a lot of people still use Logic. Our string arranger uses it because you can print out charts from it. I suppose I'm used to Pro Tools, though: I love the speed. Nearly always the best performance is the one that comes first, so you have to be able to capture it. But I'm not a huge fan of recording things time and time again - I can usually fix things in the mix.
FM: Any advice for aspiring producers?
NR: I would always follow an instinct and never be afraid of going into the red, like the records I'm most interested in - everyone from The Velvet Underground and The Beatles to Goldfrapp. Dr Dre is as on the edge as any producer, as are The Neptunes. I like a lot of American R&B, those guys know exactly what they're doing with the rhythm tracks. They're just vibier than the rock guys. So much music is uninspired these days.
FM: What do you think the next big development for producers will be?
NR: At the moment we're doing the final few mixups with hookups over at EDnet. It's really cool, you go into a studio and hook up with a really fast phone line. Then you basically hear the final mix as it's happening, in perfect quality. So I can be sitting in New York and say to our mixer at the Townhouse in London, can you add a bit more top end to the strings and move that drum over to the left? And he can hear everything, so he just tweaks it all. So that is the future, and I'm sure that pretty soon we'll have a huge screen so you can see what's happening too.
FM: A lot of young bands exchange WAV files and MP3s via instant-messaging programs these days.
NR: It makes complete sense - if I was starting a new band that would be the best way to do it. I'd have one person on each continent ... and have a videographer streaming the process in real time onto the Internet! That's the kind of digital technology I embrace, rather than things which just copy what was already great. I was in a hotel in Miami a few years ago and I saw one of the hip-hop producers doing his final mix on Pro Tools on a laptop. That was the first time I'd ever seen someone preparing a mix in a hotel that he was going to send to the record label.
FM: Finally, what are you going to do when your last vintage synth gives up the ghost?
NR: Well, I've got a nightmare at the moment, actually. I've got another great rare synth called the Elka Synthex, and it's completely stopped working. Apparently there's only one guy in Italy that repairs them, because nobody else has got the schematics. The guy that I usually use opened it up and said (adopts cynical keyboard-tech voice) you gotta' be kidding - it's like a fuckin' alien built this!
But we're such a funny little community of tech-heads. Whenever anybody needs schematics, I happily make copies of them for them - because it's the only way to keep this thing alive.
